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Post by Bot on Feb 21, 2012 21:17:47 GMT -5
Sorry, I just can't root for my teams to lose. I'm not wired that way. I know that ping pong balls would help the Cavs a great deal more than a meaningless win over the Pistons, but I still want the win.
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Post by Bot on Feb 21, 2012 21:23:04 GMT -5
Btw, Irving is putting on a fucking beautiful show with his passes tonight.
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CASH
New Member
unemployed, wreckless alcoholic
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Post by CASH on Feb 21, 2012 23:36:14 GMT -5
I was just saying in Koesters Kavs Forum at tOBR that i'd never cheer for my team to lose, although I'd have no problem with them losing. I'd rather watch Kyrie and Gee work some magic like they did tonight. I've probably watched 7-8 games all year, but I was glad I tuned in to this one. Thompson did well against Monroe too. When it comes down to it, we'll still at the very least be a 8-12 pick in the draft, so i'll never complain about a win like this. And yeah, Hollins still licks my balls.
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aoxo
God
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Post by aoxo on Feb 22, 2012 0:06:19 GMT -5
How the hell did OKC manage to be so bad that they got Durant, Westbrook, and Harden?
I mean for fuck's sake.
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Post by e0 on Feb 22, 2012 23:50:13 GMT -5
Presti was smart enough to trade Allen, Szerbiack, Delonte and any other useful vets the second he had KD in his sight. Instead we're riding Jamo and Andy to victories......
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Post by e0 on Feb 25, 2012 13:08:41 GMT -5
Tristan Thompson: +/- is second worst on the team at -69, Cavs are scoring at 93 point per hundred and are giving up 104 points per hundred and his net48 adj is fourth worst on the team, behind only Eyenga, Harangody and Erden and just behind Hollins. It also should be noted TT has played 28% of the Cavs minutes whereas none of the other net +/- sucks have played more than 10%.
None of those stats are biblical, but ole cherry pick Pros is conveniently ignoring his old go-to.
Also, of the Cavs 20 top used 5 man units, Thompson appears in 7 of them. Of those 7 three have an eFG% over 40% (no way this could inflate offensive boards) with a his of.... 43%!!!!
MONSTER
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Post by e0 on Feb 25, 2012 13:23:01 GMT -5
Also, TT has an eFG% of !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 34.5% from 3-9 feet, 23.5% from 10-15. HOLY FUCKITTY FUCK.
Also, he only attempts half of his field goals at the rim where he has a whopping 55% eFG%, which is matched by most quality PGs.
Since TT hasn't attempted any threes his FG% is his eFG% BTW.
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aoxo
God
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Post by aoxo on Feb 25, 2012 13:24:40 GMT -5
The thing that is infuriating about TT is that it was a reach.
I try not to have a problem when high picks bust, as long as the guy was projected to go there. There are no sure things, so I can't hold it (or I can, but I try not to) against a GM for picking a guy near his projected spot who might have an 80% chance of success when it turns out he busts.
Best examples are guys like Courtney Brown.
I've mentioned this before, but I think there is way more randomness to draft success, at least at the top, than people want to admit. Just because a team hits on a few guys in a row and another team misses doesn't mean the first team is much smarter. Maybe they just got a few heads and the other team got a few tails. This obviously changes the deeper you go in the draft, for various reasons (imperfect information and inability to scout every prospect, importance of fit, difficulty weighing the strengths and flaws of lesser prospects, etc).
I guess what I'm saying is that for top players, the market is more or less efficient but it gets worse the deeper you go. So why go deeper than you need to (TT)?
Everyone from the GMs on down through the media and finally to the fans wants to believe it's all under their control and label people as geniuses. It's not.
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Post by e0 on Feb 25, 2012 13:30:31 GMT -5
Yep, I fully agree.
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aoxo
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Post by aoxo on Feb 25, 2012 13:30:53 GMT -5
And I'll just throw another thought out there: it is beyond easy to look back at busts and assign blame to a negative trait that people knew about beforehand. It is also overly simplistic. Guys don't fail for one reason, and I'm sure for any reason you find there are guys out there who made the HOF who had the same knock. It's the worst kind of hindsight, even more pernicious than judging coaching decisions by their success.
Oh, Courtney Brown had no intensity, the Quiet Storm! Yeah, well tell that to Teddy Roosevelt.
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Post by e0 on Feb 25, 2012 13:33:09 GMT -5
It's different when you draft a guy that you *know* has no skills though (and you don't even draft the highest upside guy of that bunch, when Biyombo was out there, who, btw is getting better and better whereas TT's February splits were actually his worst of the year)
Not trading Jamo yet, not trading Sessions yet, not trading Andy, reaching for TT, Gilby wants that eight seed.
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aoxo
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Post by aoxo on Feb 25, 2012 13:33:53 GMT -5
Right, not trying to defend TT pick. Stupid pick.
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Post by bwwyyyy on Feb 25, 2012 14:57:20 GMT -5
I still don't think the TT pick was that bad of a pick.
Obviously, there are guys I thought would have been better picks, but in a draft class that's pretty much consensus caca, going against the grain a bit and taking a guy you like who's rated a little lower than other shittily-rated prospects, I think that's a perfectly defensible move.
Williams over Kyrie at #1 would have been a bad pick. Meh prospect TT over Meh prospect Jonas & Meh prospect Bismack? That just looks to me like going with your preferred flavor of Meh.
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Post by e0 on Feb 25, 2012 17:52:45 GMT -5
Bismack plays center, is 7 foot, is even more athletic and shoots 55% from the field. As his minutes have grown so has his production by the way, both of which have been consistent over the course of the year, as TT has cost himself playing time and sucks.
Either way, neither of them should have been the pick, but they didn't even pick the best raw athlete prospect.
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Post by Orenthal on Feb 25, 2012 18:00:44 GMT -5
Huh?
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Post by e0 on Feb 25, 2012 20:49:22 GMT -5
Vala should have been the pick.
If they wanted raw upside for some stupid reason Bismack should have been the pick.
Especially because with Bismack you could have at least gotten a center and a guy that won't chuck three footers he can't make.
And I don't know why I wrote that Bismack is 7 foot, Pros melted my brain.
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aj
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Post by aj on Feb 25, 2012 21:22:10 GMT -5
Vala should have been the pick. If they wanted raw upside for some stupid reason Bismack should have been the pick. Agree 100%. Everything about TT screams first big man off the bench on a quality team. Vala seems far more likely to be a plus center on an elite team. Not great, but he would have been my pick. The crazy part is there doesn't seem any urgency to flip Ramon and Jamo (and possibly Andy) right now. Gilbert is trying to make us the Atlanta Hawks as quickly as possible.
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Post by e0 on Feb 25, 2012 21:34:46 GMT -5
Wrong, this roster has MILES to go to be the Hawks.
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Post by e0 on Feb 25, 2012 21:37:37 GMT -5
BTW: if Horford never gets hurt this would have easily been the best Hawks team of the decade. Shame.
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aj
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Post by aj on Feb 25, 2012 21:44:27 GMT -5
Wrong, this roster has MILES to go to be the Hawks. Did I say our roster is close to being the Hawks?
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Post by e0 on Feb 25, 2012 21:47:24 GMT -5
Fair point, but you have to have TT turn into Josh Smith, draft an Al Horford in the top five, have your starting SF come in the top five, etc....
He isn't even following their blueprint, they were built the traditional way, buy collecting a bunch of young talent and signing a stud to compliment em.
Heh, they still did pass on CP3 for Marvin Williams, a freshman sixth man at UNC.
Unless he bring in Gordon and Chandler while finding a stud center somewhere this team doesn't even have a prayer of turning into the Hawks.
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aj
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Post by aj on Feb 25, 2012 21:50:41 GMT -5
My point wasn't how they were built, but how their outlook is going forward. Gilbert is going to make this team 5 seedish soon, and we will be stuck there for a long time. He is cutting too many corners.
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Post by e0 on Feb 25, 2012 21:50:44 GMT -5
Oh and the Raptors brought Chandler in for a visit, the Cavs did not.
GEE 4 LIFE
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Post by e0 on Feb 25, 2012 21:56:45 GMT -5
My point wasn't how they were built, but how their outlook is going forward. Gilbert is going to make this team 5 seedish soon, and we will be stuck there for a long time. He is cutting too many corners. Not arguing there, but I don't even see the plan to get to the five seed. Those guys still being on the roster is the opposite of getting to the five seed, it is building for the eight seed in a shit conference.
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aj
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Post by aj on Feb 25, 2012 22:05:13 GMT -5
My point wasn't how they were built, but how their outlook is going forward. Gilbert is going to make this team 5 seedish soon, and we will be stuck there for a long time. He is cutting too many corners. Not arguing there, but I don't even see the plan to get to the five seed. Those guys still being on the roster is the opposite of getting to the five seed, it is building for the eight seed in a shit conference. Agreed for this year. I see the lack of a desire to bottom out right now while not buying out Jamo to start losing some games. Combine that with them taking TT over Vala (which seems like it was related to waiting a year for his buy out) and I see some serious fundamental flaws in how the FO plans to build this team. But I do trust Gilbert to spend money. I wouldn't be surprised to see us over pay for some FA's here in the near future as well.
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Post by e0 on Feb 25, 2012 22:10:30 GMT -5
Buying out Jamo? Plenty of contenders will happily take him for free.
And not many Al Horford's are available in FA.
Eric Gordon may be the highest upside young FA to come available over the next long time (non-superstar with superstar upside) that could be a target. We'll see if they even go after him hard.
A Batum and Gordon FA would be a HUGE step in putting together a real team. Just have to find an offensive four and bench magically.
With this group of quality young FAs not bottom out is especially stupid. They could have put together a fairly awesome young core in a two year period if Gilbert planned on spending big bones.
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aj
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Post by aj on Feb 26, 2012 11:22:53 GMT -5
With this group of quality young FAs not bottom out is especially stupid. They could have put together a fairly awesome young core in a two year period if Gilbert planned on spending big bones. Yes, that is my point. Not that we should get a Horford in FA. That is stupid. I don't see anyway that Batum hits the market, btw. And getting Jamo off the team ASAP was my point. If you could find a contender that would take him and save us some cash then that is great. But if you can't buy him out now and start losing some games. Why hasn't Sessions been shipped to LA yet?
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Post by e0 on Feb 26, 2012 13:49:31 GMT -5
In a world where contenders are bringing in Rasheed Wallace for help Antwan Jameson have value.
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Post by Bot on Mar 19, 2012 21:51:36 GMT -5
Double T shit all over the Nets tonight! WOOO TRISTAN THOMPSON! WOOO!
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Post by Orenthal on Mar 20, 2012 8:36:16 GMT -5
BETTER THAN BISMACK!
PROPER USE OF THAN/THEN!
THX BOB HARRIS!
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